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Who owns auction times?
06-06-2018, 02:33 AM
Post: #1
Who owns auction times?
For as long as I've been a part of the community (over 6 years now), it has always been my impression and belief that auction times belong to the auctioneers. As a friend pointed out - sims can't build stages, perv cats, advertise them or call a panel and sell a kitty - the auctioneer does all of that so the time slot belongs to the auctioneer (I'm talking about you, Kiki Wink ). Sims host the auctions and provide a place for the auctioneer to provide their service. This arrangement is beneficial in a number of ways for both the sims and auctioneers. Typically, the auctioneer is given an incentive to host their auction on a sim such as free rent for a shop on the host sim. The sim benefits by the traffic that the auction draws and will consistently get that traffic. And the auctioneer benefits also by being exposed to other patrons of the sim. It's a win for all.

However, I've noticed not all subscribe to this belief so I thought I'd put it out to the community as a whole and see what the prevailing thought was.

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06-06-2018, 07:20 AM (This post was last modified: 06-06-2018 07:20 AM by Tad Carlucci.)
Post: #2
RE: Who owns auction times?
It's up to the sim owner and auctioneers to work out.

Maybe it's more important to the sim owner to be sure there's only one auction going on at a time across all her regions.

Or maybe the sim owner wants only one auction area and leaves it to the auctioneers to work out.

Or maybe a group of auctioneers works it out among themselves about when and were each will work.

If you don't like the rules, find a region/owner/group/auctioneers/whatever which you do like.
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06-06-2018, 10:07 PM
Post: #3
RE: Who owns auction times?
In the past, the auctioneers decided that it would be best to not overlap each other as it wasn't a competition but a community. And as I said, auctioneers always owned the times.

It matters who owns the times though... if the auctioneer does, then if a sim location isn't working for them, moving to another sim would be something they might do to improve their business success as it would be their "business" and they would do what's they feel is best for it. However, if it belongs to the sim, then essentially the auctioneer is an employee of the sim and if the auctioneer doesn't feel things are going well, then leaving the sim also means they give up the auction time and it may be impossible for them to auction elsewhere unless another time that fits within their schedule happens to be available. Being an auctioneer isn't just being able to read a pedigree - it involves being able to determine hidden traits and do a little teaching, sales, advertising, photography and bonus points for building your own stage.

So again, who owns the time? The person who does all the work or the place that provides the space?

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06-07-2018, 02:42 AM
Post: #4
RE: Who owns auction times?
(06-06-2018 02:33 AM)Navaar Resident Wrote:  For as long as I've been a part of the community (over 6 years now), it has always been my impression and belief that auction times belong to the auctioneers.

This is an interesting question and I have thought about it. I would say the auction times belong to the auctioneers and can understand why it has always been that way. The auctioneers are the ones who have the following and draw traffic to sims. Does that make sense?
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06-07-2018, 02:54 AM
Post: #5
RE: Who owns auction times?
To me, it does. But I know not all agree and it has been a point of contention for some that I know. So, I thought I'd post the question to the general community to see if perhaps feelings changed or if the consensus was still that the time belongs to the auctioneers and not the sims.

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06-07-2018, 07:43 AM
Post: #6
RE: Who owns auction times?
Sims don't auction cats. Auctioneers auction cats.

Really, a sim can't auction a cat without an auctioneer. If an auctioneer leaves the sim, the sim has to get another auctioneer to do it.
See above: sims don't auction cats. Auctioneers auction cats. Also, sims can't just conjure auctioneers. It takes a certain skill-set to be a good auctioneer.

Once upon a time, long ago, there was a thread about auctioneering time. And I will say again what I said then, which is that nobody owns time. The time is free for any hobbyist who wishes to take up auctioneering - and Hypothetically there could be, for instance, a Japanese-speaking auction for a Japanese set of cat lovers at say, the same time as an Australian English-speaking audience auction - if there were enough auction-attendees to support such a thing. BUT, this is a community, and people (by which I mean auctioneers) have over the years found ways to cooperate and try not to step on other people's toes to provide auction coverage in all time zones. And we also all know that many auctions are under-attended and it would be great to move More people into having fun in SL by going to auctions as a fun event, much as in RL people go to auctions for fun. More people attending would take some stress off the events.

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06-07-2018, 07:51 AM
Post: #7
RE: Who owns auction times?
Nobody "owns" a time slot.

If another auctioneer decides to hold an auction at the same time as another, too bad.

If you were running an auction at a given time and decided to move elsewhere and someone else decides to run an auction at the same time and location you just vacated, too bad.

You don't have to like it, and you can complain about it, to some extent. But you're running close to rules violations when you come here and name names. And, if you take it in-world, you'll need to be careful about violating the LL ToS.

Your best course of action, if you want your auction location and time to be the "go-to" auction at that time-slot is to stop complaining and up your game.

Let's face it, as a buyer, most auctions aren't worth the effort of teleporting to. The selection will be poor and the the auctioneer terrible.

As an auctioneer, it's your responsibility to know the product. That means knowing the current market prices and knowing breeding.

If someone wants to put out a cat an opening ask of 15,000 L$, which just like hundreds of others which have been selling for 500 L$, it's your job to get them to lower their ask or kick them out. If you don't your auction will get a reputation (among buyers) for over-priced, worthless cats, and people will stay away and you'll get a reputation for never selling (among sellers).

If someone wants to sell a cat which has no chance of hiding the latest-and-greatest fur, it's your responsibility to honestly sell the cat and not falsely represent it as "hiding" something it clearly cannot have.

Your job, as an auctioneer, it to be an honest broker for your customers: the sellers. You do that by guiding them to good choices, and performing for them by selling their product. You do THAT by creating an environment which is fun and where everyone, buyers and sellers, feel they're being treated honestly and fairly.

So, if you think someone has poached "your" time slot and are upset because they're stealing "your" customers, instead of being upset with your competitor, ask yourself WHY "your" customers are leaving for the new event? Are you selling cats? Can the sellers trust you to guide them to better sales? Can the buyers trust you to be honestly offering quality products? Are you too rushed, too slow, too boring, too easily off-track? Are they just trying the new place because yours is just the same as everyplace else?

Most likely, it's not that someone "stole" your time slot, it's that you're doing so poorly you're not actually there, anyway.
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06-07-2018, 11:14 AM
Post: #8
RE: Who owns auction times?
Tad -

While I am an auctioneer, I'm not currently auctioning by choice. Part of why I'm asking this is because someone recently moved their auction and is now being told they stole the auction time from the old location.

So, while your advice is valid on some points, it also comes across as rude and accusatory. I have not mentioned anyone or anyplace... in fact I'm purposely avoiding doing so. Because what I know this isn't the first time something like above has happened.

Auctioneers have always chosen to not to overlap out of a sense of community rather than competing with one another.

As far as how auctions are run... yes, auctioneers should be able to perv a cat and know its hidden in order to sell it... and sometimes that includes advising their patron that a certain trait cannot be hidden and why. Auctioneers may be aware of prices but the general rule of thumb for most auctions is don't ask the auctioneer for pricing suggestions because if the auctioneer under or over prices the seller's cat then the seller is blaming the auctioneer for the bad price. A good auctioneer will, however, direct the seller to resources such as Torgon's site for researching current market prices.

Thanks for your input though...

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06-07-2018, 07:54 PM
Post: #9
RE: Who owns auction times?
(06-07-2018 07:43 AM)Ivy Norsk Wrote:  Hypothetically there could be, for instance, a Japanese-speaking auction for a Japanese set of cat lovers at say, the same time as an Australian English-speaking audience auction - if there were enough auction-attendees to support such a thing. BUT, this is a community, and people (by which I mean auctioneers) have over the years found ways to cooperate and try not to step on other people's toes to provide auction coverage in all time zones. And we also all know that many auctions are under-attended and it would be great to move More people into having fun in SL by going to auctions as a fun event, much as in RL people go to auctions for fun. More people attending would take some stress off the events.

I would love to see more people attend the auctions... I think I learned more about breeding and perving cats at auctions than I did on my own.

I don't think people realize how often auctions are happening or where, though - even though most post them in the forums and advertise them in a variety of groups. My other thought is that the newer breeders might not realize that auctions are open to everyone and are a good place to meet other breeders, find some amazing cats, and learn a bit more about breeding. Oh, and are, generally, a lot of fun! Smile

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06-08-2018, 12:36 AM (This post was last modified: 06-08-2018 12:36 AM by Minx Diabolito.)
Post: #10
RE: Who owns auction times?
Hello! I just wanted to make a comment about this tho I won't say much because it will take away from the subject of this thread and is probably for another thread altogether

"I don't think people realize how often auctions are happening or where". I cannot speak for people in general but of all of the people I know involved in cats, most of us are fully aware of auctions and feel there are too many auctions overall, but most of all there are a number of factors that put people off attending. I will give one example - auctioneers can do a lot of spamming and not caring if you don't want the mass IM and TPs. So, if we don't go, we minimise the chance of that. Unfortunately because it is so rife and long-standing, it tars those who don't do it with the same brush a lot of the time. It also puts me off even putting my own cats for sale or renting a panel because I really don't come to SL to get the heck spammed out of me =/

So maybe an interesting question to also ask is "I don't think some auctioneers realize why even though people are often very aware of auctions, they are choosing not to attend". But I think this can be a different thread for anyone interested in this question to create.

Hugs to all =)
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